《菲中評論網香港訊》《中國日報》雙語新聞報導稱，據駐美國大使館網站8月19日消息，8月16日，中國駐美大使秦剛接受半島電視台英文頻道「底線」（The Bottom Line）欄目主持人、美國「旗語」新聞社及《國會山報》特邀編輯克萊門斯（Steve Clemons）專訪，重點就台灣問題、中美關係回答提問。採訪內容已於8月18日播出（有刪節），現場完整實錄（中譯文）如下：
On August 16, Chinese Ambassador to the US Qin Gang took an exclusive interview with Steve Clemons, host of Al Jazeera English Channel’s “The Bottom Line” and editor at large of The Hill and ”Semafor”, answering questions about the Taiwan question, China-US relations and so on. The interview was aired on August 18 (abridged). The transcript of the full interview is as follows:
克萊門斯：為抗議美國國會眾議長佩洛西訪台，中方暫停了多項美中雙邊對話合作，涉及氣候變化、禁毒合作、地區安全及軍事協調各方面。拜登總統也中止採取行動取消前總統特朗普對中國輸美產品加徵的關稅。儘管雙邊關係螺旋式下降，兩國還是緊密聯繫著，去年一年的雙邊貿易額高達7000多億美元。
所以美中互為戰略夥伴、戰略競爭者還是戰略敵手？這對你我和世界又意味著什麼？
Clemons: In protest of Pelosi’s visit, China halted numerous bilateral talks and collaboration on everything from climate change, to drug trafficking, to regional security and military coordination. And President Joe Biden has stalled any action on lifting trade sanctions imposed by his predecessor Donald Trump on Chinese imports. But despite the downward spiral, the two nations are joined at the hip, doing over $700 billion a year in trade with each other. So what are they — strategic partners, strategic competitors, or strategic enemies? And what does it mean to you, to me, and to the rest of the world?
今天我們請來了中國駐美大使秦剛，他曾任中國外交部副部長。大使，能跟您交流太好了。我非常想讓觀眾們瞭解一下中方立場。我們看到佩洛西訪台了，中方曾警告她不要去，去了會有嚴重後果。為什麼台灣對中方來說在戰略上如此重要？
Joining me today is China’s Ambassador to the United States Qin Gang. Prior to this post, he served as the Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs in Beijing. Ambassador, it’s great to be with you today and talk to you. And I really want our audience to understand the Chinese dashboard. When it comes to Taiwan, we’ve seen the trip of House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. You warned her not to go and said there would be consequences. Why does Taiwan matter so significantly to you strategically?
秦大使：感謝你邀請我來。佩洛西竄訪台灣是魯莽的挑釁之舉，是對美台實質關係的升級，違背美方在中美三個聯合公報中作出的承諾，包括世界上只有一個中國，中華人民共和國政府是代表全中國的唯一合法政府，美不同台灣發展官方關係。我們觀察了佩洛西訪台的言論，這不是非官方訪問。她在抵台後發表的聲明中講得很清楚，她的訪問是官方性質的。她本人也不是普通人，而是美國政府三號人物，具有高度政治敏感性。因此，佩洛西赴台活動，宣稱美國和蔡英文當局站在一起，而蔡英文所屬的民進黨把謀求「台獨」明確寫入了黨綱，美方這就是在為「台獨」分裂勢力撐腰打氣。
Ambassador Qin: Thank you, Steve, for having me. Nancy Pelosi’s visit to Taiwan was reckless and provocative, because it upgraded the substantive relations between the United States and Taiwan, and it violates the US commitments in the three Joint Communiques between China and the United States that there’s only one China, the Government of the People’s Republic of China is the sole legal government representing the whole and same China, and the United States will not develop official links with Taiwan. On Nancy Pelosi’s visit to Taiwan, we have heard and we have seen what she did and what she said. It’s not an unofficial visit. She said very clearly in her statement upon arrival in Taiwan that her visit is official. She is not a person in the street. She’s number three in the US government. And she carries great political sensitivities. So by going to Taiwan, declaring that the United States sides with the Tsai Ing-wen authorities, which put “Taiwan independence” on its political agenda, in the Democratic Progressive Party’s constitution. It’s a show of the United States emboldening “Taiwan independence” separatist forces.
這就是為什麼中國政府和人民對此事反應強烈。我們強烈、堅決反對，並採取了反制措施。佩洛西竄訪台灣地區的後果非常嚴重，中方在她訪問前就向美方反復發出警告，表示會有很嚴重後果。現在我們正在處理她竄訪帶來的後果。
So that’s why the Chinese government and Chinese people are feeling so strongly about it. We oppose it strongly and firmly. And we are responding to it. Now we are dealing with the fallout of her visit.
克萊門斯：有件事讓我吃驚，雖然拜登總統沒有勸她不要去，但國安部門、五角大樓和效命於拜登總統的國安官員都對她的訪問表達了嚴重關切，認為這可能會觸發（緊張）。對於美政府內部在這個問題上有不同看法以及很多人並不支持她訪問，您沒有感到一點欣慰嗎？
Clemons: One of the things that I have been surprised by after her visit was that while President Biden did not ask her not to go, the national security bureaucracy, the Pentagon, various national security officials that work for President Biden, were very concerned about her visit and thought that it would be a trigger. Were you heartened in any way to see that divide in the government that there were a lot of people in the US government who did not support her, the trip？
秦大使：我們只看結果。國會是美國政府的一部分，有義務遵守和履行美國的外交政策。任何國家都只有一套外交政策。總不能行政部門有一套，國會另有一套吧。我們對已經發生的事態強烈不滿，認為美國行政部門沒有為勸阻她竄訪盡力。
Ambassador Qin: We only pay attention to the end result. Congress is a part of the US government, and Congress is obliged to respect and follow the American foreign policy. In any country, there’s only one foreign policy. So you can’t say that the executive branch has one and Congress has another one. And we are dissatisfied with what has happened already. We don’t believe that the executive branch of the United States government has done enough to stop her going.
克萊門斯：還有一個問題也是關聯的，現在民主、共和兩黨重要人物都對中國有關切，這是兩黨為數不多的共識。我認為美方對中國有一種不安全感，包括對中國的經濟增長、強有力的全球地位、「一帶一路」倡議等。很多美國人會說，我們也想要這些，想要「一帶一路」倡議，但又對中方在全球中的影響力深感不安。希望您能讓觀眾瞭解一下中國未來的道路是什麼？中國對美國和世界有怎樣的大戰略？中國想在世界上取得什麼成就？
Clemons: One of the things that is also, I think, part of the picture, one of the few bipartisan areas of agreement between many leading Democrats and leading Republicans, is concerns about China. I think there’s an insecurity about China. I think it’s insecurity about Chinese economic growth, its strong position around the world, the Belt and Road Initiative. I think a lot of Americans say, hey, we wish we had a Belt and Road Initiative or wish we had these things, but there’s an insecurity about China’s place in the world today. I’m just interested in understanding from you and having our listeners understand what is China’s glide path. What is its grand strategy with regard to not only the United States, but the world? What is China trying to achieve in the world?
秦大使：首先，中國致力於讓本國人民過上更好的生活。這是中國共產黨和中國政府的使命和宗旨。我們努力讓自己變得更富強，從而不斷滿足人民對美好生活的嚮往。同時，中國也為世界和平、安全和共同發展作出更多貢獻，是支持和平穩定的力量。但遺憾的是，中國被誤解誤判成美國的挑戰甚至威脅、試圖取代美國。這不是我們的目標。我們希望與美方保持穩定、合作關係，因為我們認為中美有巨大的共同責任和共同利益。我們在國內都各自面臨挑戰，首先要做的就是把自己的事情辦好。搞好中美關係符合兩國利益，符合國際社會追求和平、安全和攜手應對共同挑戰的願望。
Ambassador Qin: First of all, China is working for delivering a better life to its own people. This is the centerpiece of the mission of the Communist Party of China and the government of China. What we are doing is make ourselves stronger and more prosperous so that we can satisfy our people’s desire for a better life. At the same time, China can have more to deliver for world peace, security and common development. China is a force for peace and stability. But regrettably, my country is being mis-perceived and miscalculated. Some people see China as a challenge or even a threat trying to replace the United States. It’s not our intention. We want to have stable and cooperative relations with the United States, because we do believe that China and the United States have massive shared responsibilities and common interests. We have our challenges at home. I think that the first thing to do for each of us is manage our own affairs well, and a good relationship between China and the United States will serve the interests of our two countries and will meet the desire of the international community for peace, security, and for joint efforts to tackle their common challenges the international community is facing.
令人遺憾的是，中美關係的現狀非常令人擔憂，正在走下坡路。正如我所說，這是因為中國被誤解誤判，中美關係被恐懼而非共同利益和共同責任驅動。人們忘記了，我們去年雙邊貿易額已經超過7500億美元，中美是彼此最重要的貿易夥伴之一。新冠肺炎疫情之前，兩國人員往來每年多達500萬次，數十萬中國學生在美留學，越來越多的美國年輕人選擇赴華留學。我認為是時候把常識、共同利益和共同責任重新放到中美關係的中心位置了。分歧不應成為對抗的藉口，也不應把我們引向對抗衝突的錯誤道路。
And sadly, the status quo of China-US relations is very worrisome, and is going downhill. This is because, as I mentioned, that China is being mis-perceived and miscalculated, and China-US relations now is being driven by fear, not by the common interests and by the common responsibilities of our countries. People forget that the bilateral trade volume annually between our two countries has exceeded $750 billion. People forget that before Covid, there were five million mutual visits between our two countries. And people forget that China and the United States are one of the most important trading partners to each other. People forget there are hundreds of thousands of Chinese students studying in the United States, and more and more American young people choose China to study in. I think it’s time to bring common sense, common interests and common responsibility back to the center stage of China-US relations, and our differences and disagreements cannot justify confrontation and should not lead us to a wrong path to confrontation and conflict.
克萊門斯：大使，您已經來美一年了，瞭解美國，與很多不同的人打交道。我聽您最近用到「威脅恐懼症」這個詞，美國內涉台言論不斷升級也反映了這一點。您認為是什麼導致美國人對中國行為的擔憂和關切不斷加劇？
Clemons: Ambassador, what do you think? I know you’ve been over here now for a year. You know the United States, and you meet with so many different people. I’ve heard you recently use the term “threat-phobia”, and using the escalation of rhetoric over Taiwan in the United States is part of that. What do you think is driving American worries and concerns about Chinese behavior from your perspective?
秦大使：我认为美国确实存在“中国恐惧症”，而且还在蔓延。
Ambassador Qin: I think there is indeed a fear or “China-phobia” in the United States and it’s spreading.
And sadly, the status quo of China-US relations is very worrisome, and is going downhill. This is because, as I mentioned, that China is being mis-perceived and miscalculated, and China-US relations now is being driven by fear, not by the common interests and by the common responsibilities of our countries. People forget that the bilateral trade volume annually between our two countries has exceeded $750 billion. People forget that before Covid, there were five million mutual visits between our two countries. And people forget that China and the United States are one of the most important trading partners to each other. People forget there are hundreds of thousands of Chinese students studying in the United States, and more and more American young people choose China to study in. I think it’s time to bring common sense, common interests and common responsibility back to the center stage of China-US relations, and our differences and disagreements cannot justify confrontation and should not lead us to a wrong path to confrontation and conflict.
克莱门斯：大使，您已经来美一年了，了解美国，与很多不同的人打交道。我听您最近用到“威胁恐惧症”这个词，美国内涉台言论不断升级也反映了这一点。您认为是什么导致美国人对中国行为的担忧和关切不断加剧？
Clemons: Ambassador, what do you think? I know you’ve been over here now for a year. You know the United States, and you meet with so many different people. I’ve heard you recently use the term “threat-phobia”, and using the escalation of rhetoric over Taiwan in the United States is part of that. What do you think is driving American worries and concerns about Chinese behavior from your perspective?
秦大使：我认为美国确实存在“中国恐惧症”，而且还在蔓延。
Ambassador Qin: I think there is indeed a fear or “China-phobia” in the United States and it’s spreading.
克莱门斯：这是种族主义吗？
Clemons: Is that racism?
秦大使：也许你可以自己判断，但我确实觉得在这个国家，仇亚情绪正在上升。中国科学家、中国留学生在美越来越感到不安全。我们各领域正常交流合作也受到这种恐惧的负面影响。
Ambassador Qin: Maybe you can make a judgment, but I do feel that in this country, Asian hate is on the rise. Chinese scientists, Chinese students feel more and more unsafe in the country. Our normal interactions, cooperation in various fields, are now being affected negatively by fear.
：這是種族主義嗎？
Clemons: Is that racism?
秦大使：也許你可以自己判斷，但我確實覺得在這個國家，仇亞情緒正在上升。中國科學家、中國留學生在美越來越感到不安全。我們各領域正常交流合作也受到這種恐懼的負面影響。
Ambassador Qin: Maybe you can make a judgment, but I do feel that in this country, Asian hate is on the rise. Chinese scientists, Chinese students feel more and more unsafe in the country. Our normal interactions, cooperation in various fields, are now being affected negatively by fear.
克莱门斯：我认为很多美国人都会关注他们在中国大陆、台湾和香港看到的情况。例如，在“清零”政策下，许多人被迫在家隔离很长时间，在Youtube视频里能看出他们的沮丧；在香港，大规模抗议活动被压制，而很多美国人认为这是民主运动；台湾人担心他们未来的自治状态，有些人表示想寻求独立，许多美国人对此有认同感。我感兴趣的是，这些会不会在未来触发危机。中方对此有何回应？会采取什么措施缓解美方担忧，即美方认为中国试图压制自治、基本自由和人权，以促进美中互信关系。为什么台湾的局势会如此易于紧张升级？也许部分原因是很多美国人更支持“自由”的一方。
Clemons: I think a lot of Americans look at what they see in China and Taiwan, and in Hong Kong. Some of what they see are, say the zero-Covid policy, where many people are locked in their residences for very long time. And we’ve seen the youtube videos, etc, people and their frustration. Or in Hong Kong, we saw massive protests that were put down. A lot of Americans, because they believe that that was a democracy movement, or they see Taiwanese worry about their future autonomy, and even some of them said they want independence. There’s a sort of affinity that many Americans feel for that. And I guess I’m interested when it comes to triggering this crisis again in the future. What is your response on those things? How can China either respond on those situations to alleviate Americans’ concerns that China is trying to squelch autonomy and, basically, basic freedoms and human rights, to have a more trusted relationship? I am just sort of interested in why Taiwan is in such an exploitable situation that it can lead to a quick escalation like it did. And I think part of it is because so many Americans basically have empathy for freedom.
秦大使：台湾问题从根本上说不是民主和自由的问题，而是中国国家主权和领土完整的问题，是中国人民的民族尊严问题。历史表明，台湾自古以来就是中国的一部分。历史上，台湾曾被荷兰殖民者和日本侵略者从祖国分割出去，中国人民作出巨大努力、付出巨大代价收复了台湾。所以人们需要了解历史，了解国际法。这里国际法指的是什么？ 就是一个中国原则，世界上只有一个中国，海峡两岸同属一个中国，中华人民共和国政府是代表全中国的唯一合法政府。这在国际法中得到了确认和记载，也是二战后国际秩序的一部分。这些关于台湾的国际文件，比如1943年的《开罗宣言》以及1945年的《波茨坦公告》，美国领导人都签署了。所以美国是利益相关方，应该发扬契约精神，履行自身国际义务，恪守在中美三个联合公报中作出的承诺。
Ambassador Qin: The question of Taiwan, fundamentally speaking, is not about democracy or freedom. It’s about China’s national sovereignty and territorial integrity. It’s about the national dignity of Chinese people. The historical fact is that Taiwan has been part of China since ancient times. In history, Taiwan was separated from its motherland by the Dutch colonialists and Japanese invaders. But the Chinese people worked so hard, paid a huge cost to get Taiwan back to the motherland. So people need to understand history and need to know the international law. What is the international law? The one-China principle. There’s only one China. Both sides of the Taiwan Strait belong to one and the same China. And the Government of the People’s Republic of China is the sole legal government representing the whole of China. This has been confirmed and written in international law. And it’s been part of the post-WWII international order. International documents concerning Taiwan, like the Cairo Declaration in the year 1943 and the subsequent Potsdam Proclamation in 1945, were signed up by American leaders. The United States is a stakeholder, and the United States should carry on the spirit of contract, to honor its international obligations and to honor its commitments in the three China-US joint communiqués.
所以，當中國人民看到佩洛西竄訪台灣，給「台獨」分裂勢力站台時，反應非常強烈。這是公然挑釁，傷害了中國人民的民族尊嚴和感情。而關於台灣的前途，第一，我們將以最大的誠意，盡最大的努力實現和平統一的前景。因為兩岸是同胞，最不願意看到的就是骨肉相殘。我們將盡最大努力實現和平統一，並為此創造有利條件。和平統一的核心是建立在一個中國基礎上的「一國兩制」。海峽兩岸有一個共同身份，就是中國人，所以我們會像處理家庭內務一樣解決這個問題。關於統一後的政治安排，我們也會充分考慮台灣的現實和台灣人民的感情。我們制定了「一國兩制」基本方針，在堅持一個中國原則基礎上實現和平統一後，台灣可以保留不同於大陸的政治社會制度，這是一個民主和包容的方案。
We feel so strongly when Chinese people see that Nancy Pelosi was in Taiwan and siding with those “Taiwan independence” separatist forces. This is a blatant provocation and it hurts. It hurts Chinese people’s national dignity and sentiments. On the future of Taiwan, first, we will make our utmost efforts and show the greatest sincerity to achieve the prospect of a peaceful reunification, because people on both sides of the Taiwan Strait are compatriots. It is the last thing to do to fight between compatriots. We will try our best to achieve peaceful reunification. And we will try to create favorable conditions for that. The centerpiece for peaceful reunification is the “One Country, Two Systems” based on the foundation that there’s only one China. Both sides of the Taiwan Strait have a shared identity of being Chinese. We can solve this matter like a family issue. For the future political arrangements, we will take into full consideration the realities of Taiwan and the sentiments of the Chinese people in Taiwan. We have designed a formula, that is “One Country, Two Systems”. After the peaceful reunification based on the overarching bedrock of the one-China principle, Taiwan will have political and social systems which are different from the mainland. This is a democratic and accommodating arrangement.
克萊門斯：長期主管亞洲事務的白宮國安會印太事務協調員坎貝爾稱，不要在這件事上相信中國人，和平統一不是他們尋求的，他們以佩洛西之行為藉口尋求優勢。這是坎貝爾一個相當尖銳的抱怨了。我想知道你如何看待當前局勢，如何來讓美方認識到現在的事態很麻煩？
Clemons: Kurt Campbell, who is President Biden’s Coordinator for the Indo-Pacific affairs, is a longtime Asia hand. He actually said, don’t believe the Chinese on this, that the peaceful reunification is not the agenda they are seeking, that they used Nancy Pelosi’s trip as a pretext to position itself better and to take advantage of this moment. It’s a fairly strident complaint from Kurt Campbell. I’m just interested in how you see that moment. What will you do to send the signals that this would be troublesome?
秦大使：我不知道這位美國高官基於什麼作出這樣的公開表態，表示不相信中國會和平統一或為之付出努力。正如我剛才所說，兩岸皆同胞，我們將盡最大努力爭取和平統一前景，但不承諾放棄非和平方式實現統一，這不是針對台灣同胞，而是為了震懾一小撮「台獨」分裂勢力，防止外部勢力干涉，從而最大程度地保護和平統一的前景。
Ambassador Qin: I don’t know based on what this American senior official openly said, don’t believe China will practice or will work for peaceful reunification. As I mentioned earlier, people on both sides of the Taiwan Strait are compatriots and we will do our best to achieve peaceful reunification. But we will not renounce non-peaceful means. This is not targeting at Chinese people in Taiwan. This is to deter a handful of “Taiwan independence” separatist forces and to deter foreign intervention, so that we can best protect the prospect of peaceful reunification.
當前的危機不是中方挑起和造成的。自從得知佩洛西將訪台，我們在不同層級通過各種渠道表明中方堅決反對的態度，並反復警告美方這違背了一個中國原則，違背了美方所作的承諾。如佩執意訪台，將產生非常嚴重的後果，中方必然會作出堅決有力的回應。這是美方單方面強加給中方的危機。我們不想像美國官員說的那樣利用佩此訪打造所謂新常態。如果我們有這樣的意圖，為何作出最大努力、窮盡一切可能予以阻止？這不合邏輯。
The current crisis was not started or made by the Chinese side. Since we learned Nancy Pelosi would visit Taiwan, the Chinese side, through different channels and at different levels, expressed our firm opposition. We warned the US side time and again that this is the in violation of the one-China principle and it’s a break of the US promises. If she goes, it will have very serious consequences and the Chinese side will respond very firmly and strongly. This is a crisis unilaterally imposed on the Chinese side. We do not want to take advantage of Nancy Pelosi’s visit and to create a sort of “new normal” as claimed by the US officials. If we had a such intention, why had China worked so hard and tried every means to prevent her from going? It’s not logical.
克萊門斯：您谈到了两国经济交融、相互投资的深入程度，现在美国媒体不太提及这一点，现在经济关系出现危险了吗？中国领导人是否有意同受到挫折的美国“脱钩”？我们在华盛顿听到很多关于“脱钩”的论调。但正如您所说，两国有7500亿美元的贸易。在您看来，有什么方法可以让美中关系回到更健康的状态？
Clemons: Ambassador, you spoke about the enormous level of economic co-investment, integration. There’s an enormous economic life that isn’t getting much airtime in American media right now. Is that in danger? Is there any possibility that Chinese leaders would want to decouple from a frustrating United States? We hear about decoupling a lot in Washington. But just as you said, almost $750 billion of trade that’s underneath this noise on top. Is there any way to get back to a healthier relationship from your perspective?
秦大使：首先，中方不認為「脫鈎」符合中美任何一方的利益。鑒於中美的體量、影響力和責任，「脫鈎」將損害彼此和世界。其次，中國不想「脫鈎」。我們希望雙方通過更多交流和合作，擺脫兩國關係的困境。為此我們需要遵循一些非常重要的原則。也就是說，中美關係應該建立在習近平主席提出的相互尊重、和平共處、合作共贏的原則之上。在習近平主席和拜登總統多次交往中，兩國元首同意避免衝突、相互尊重，改善兩國關係。我們希望兩國元首達成的共識能成為中美關係發展的總指引。老實說，中方一直在這麼做。但美方能否遵循兩國元首重要共識？這是一個很大的問號。
Ambassador Qin: Firstly, China doesn’t believe that decoupling is in the interest of either China or the United States. It will hurt both of us, it will hurt the whole world, given the weight, influence and responsibilities of China and the US. Secondly, we do not want to decouple. We want more exchanges and more cooperation to get this relationship out of the current difficulties. We need to take some very important principles to heart. That is, this relationship should be built on the principle of mutual respect, peaceful coexistence, and win-win cooperation, as proposed by President Xi. In the past interactions between President Xi and President Biden, both Presidents agreed to improve our relations on the mutual understanding that there shouldn’t be any conflict and we should respect each other. So we hope that the mutual understanding between our two Presidents can be an overarching guideline to steer the direction of China-US relations. To be honest with you, this is what we have been doing all the time. But can the United States follow this important mutual understanding between the two Presidents? It is a big question mark.
克萊門斯：我記得拜登擔任副總統期間，協助安排了習近平主席和奧巴馬總統在安納伯格莊園的峰會。時任副總統的拜登第一次訪華會見習近平主席時，我是隨團記者。他們保持著很好的、相互尊重的關係。拜登擔任總統後告訴我，他尊重習近平主席，認為習近平主席是一個有遠見的思想家。你認為他們相互之間還有一定程度的信任和尊重嗎？會不會因為你關切的那些事件而受到了嚴重損害？
Clemons: I remember when then-Vice President Biden helped arrange the Sunnylands summit with Xi Jinping and Barack Obama, I was with Vice President Biden in China when he met Xi Jinping for the first time, and there seemed to be a very good relationship, a relationship of mutual respect. And Vice President Biden, now President Biden, told me that he respected Xi Jinping and thought that he was a forward thinker. Do you think there’s a level of trust still in that relationship and mutual respect? Would you think it has been now spoiled so badly by the events that you’ve been concerned about?
秦大使：我對中美之間的互信程度很擔心。出現這種狀態就是因為中國被視為挑戰，因為美國國內「中國恐懼症」泛濫。將對方視為朋友或夥伴還是將其視為威脅或挑戰，是完全不同的。那麼如何恢復互信呢？需要回到最本源的東西，即美方應公正客觀地看待中國的發展意圖，牢記兩國共同利益和責任遠大於分歧。不應讓差異或分歧阻礙雙邊關係發展，成為對抗和敵視的理由。
Ambassador Qin: I’m very concerned about the level of trust between China and the US, simply because China is being seen as a challenge, and simply because the ”China-phobia” is widely spread in the US. So if you see somebody as a friend or partner, it’s one thing; if you see somebody as a threat or a challenge, it’s a totally different story. So how to restore trust? We need to go back to the very basics. That is to have a fair and objective view of China’s intention of development and to bear in mind our common interests and common responsibilities, which we believe far outweigh our differences and disagreements. We should not let differences or disagreements stand in the way of the development of our relations. And our differences and disagreements should not justify confrontation and hostilities.
克萊門斯：多年前胡錦濤主席訪問華盛頓時，我坐在中國外交部主管政策規劃工作的負責人旁邊。我認為是一個很好的交流機會，就問他「中國的全球大戰略是什麼」。他對我開玩笑地說：「是如何讓你們美國人繼續被中東小國分散精力」。在那個時代，這的確有一定的道理。那如今中國的大戰略是什麼？
Clemons: Ambassador, years ago when then-President Hu Jintao was visiting Washington, I was seated next to a guy who was the equivalent of the director of the policy planning staff of your Ministry of Foreign Affairs. So I said, this is a great opportunity, tell me what’s China’s grand strategy in the world? His response to me, kind of joking, was how to keep you Americans distracted in small Middle Eastern countries, which had a ring of truth in it in that era. What is China’s grand strategy today?
秦大使：中國的大戰略，就是維護世界和平與安全，同世界其他國家人民攜手合作、共同發展、共享繁榮。我們希望有一個和平友好的國際環境，以便專注於國內發展，讓中國人民過上更好的生活。僅此而已。作為大使，我的角色是努力讓美方擺脫「中國恐懼症」。
Ambassador Qin: China’s grand strategy is to safeguard world peace, security, and join hands with people of all other countries for common development and shared prosperity. And we want to have a peaceful and friendly international environment for us to concentrate on our domestic development, which will deliver better lives for the Chinese people. Nothing more, nothing else. As ambassador, my role is trying to distract the United States from the fear of China and from “China-phobia”.
我講個故事，音樂劇《漢密爾頓》講述了美國首任財政部長漢密爾頓的人生經歷。漢密爾頓有一個政敵，就是當時的美國副總統亞倫·伯爾。他們在劇中並未善終，兩人進行了決鬥。在決鬥結束時，副總統伯爾懊悔道，世界足夠大，能夠容下我和漢密爾頓。
Let me give you a story. The first Secretary of the Treasury is Hamilton, and there’s a musical called “Hamilton”. He had a political enemy, that is Aaron Burr. At that time he was the Vice President of the United States. And the end result was not happy. The two men had a duel. At the end of the duel, Vice President Burr lamented, the world is big enough for me and Mr. Hamilton.
讓我們看看今天的世界和中美關係。我想借用伯爾先生的話說，世界足夠大，能夠容下中國和美國。我們不應讓200多年前的悲劇在今天重演。
So let’s look at the world today, and let’s look at China-US relations. I want to borrow Mr. Burr’s remarks, the world is big enough for China and the United States. And we don’t need to have a tragic incident from more than 200 years ago repeat itself today.
克萊門斯：中國駐美國大使秦剛，非常感謝您接受採訪並與我們坦率地討論這些問題。太感謝了。
Clemons: Ambassador Qin Gang, Chinese ambassador to United States. I really appreciate your candor for you joining us today and talking us through these issues. Thank you so much.
秦大使：謝謝。
Ambassador Qin: Thank you.
來源：中華人民共和國駐美利堅合眾國大使館官網